We are dismayed that, yet again, the introduction of Oyster Pay As You Go is to be delayed on national rail services in London, meaning passengers will continue to have to use two separate methods of payment on transport in London. As well as being confusing for passengers, it is blatantly unfair on those who live outside the tube network who are not reaping the price benefits of the Oystercard. These delays have occurred time and again over the years.
Although there is no official confirmation of a change in the delivery timescales yet (Travelwatch have indicated that their information comes from industry sources), a slippage in the rollout certainly wouldn't be outside the realms of possibility.
The battle to get Oyster PAYG onto National Rail has been long and hard, with issues both technical (such as reader ITSO compatibility, and the installation of gatelines) and political - issues that, it's probably fair to say, haven't been helped by the intransience of certain Franchise holders.
Under the former Mayor, there had begun to develop a certain "name and shame" attitude on the part of City Hall, but this is something that seemed to lessen to some degree after the regime change.
Whether an official change in the likely rollout date is confirmed remains to be seen, but its probably fair to say that there are warning signs that this may be likely. Oyster acceptance was something that the Mayor's "Operator Summit" was meant to address back in January, without result. Similarly, the Mayor was pressed again on the issue during Mayor's Question Time back in February, but the answers provided no more clarity:
Can the Mayor provide specific dates by which time each of the Train Operating Companies in London should have introduced PAYG Oyster Cards? - Richard Tracey
Not as yet.
The likely launch date remains towards the end of 2009.
We are now almost 10 months into your term. Have you set a date, agenda and invitation list for your "Emergency Public Rail Summit"? If so, what are they? - Valerie Shawcross
Considerable progress had been made in working with the train operating companies. Earlier this year we announced improvement to passenger safety, which included an additional 50 BTP officers.
Furthermore, I am confident that a resolution to Oyster ticketing on National Rail will be agreed shortly.
There are still many issues that we need to address that I will want to discuss with the Train Operating Companies and a rail summit would provide a useful focus for doing so. However, I have instructed TfL to work to continue with discussions to progress these issues.
It's not just Travelwatch that seem to think 2010 is the likely arrival date either. For some time Southeastern's website has carried the following statement in their FAQ section (bolding mine):
Do you accept Oyster cards on your network?
We do already accept season tickets on Oyster on our network (within the valid zones) but we do not currently accept Oyster pay as you go (PAYG). We are working with Transport for London (TfL) to introduce PAYG which requires significant investment with additional validators needed, automatic ticket gates at some stations, etc. It's envisaged we'll be able to introduce Oyster PAYG sometime in 2010. But it's important to say that Oyster PAYG will not be cheaper than our usual rail fares.
So hopefully Travelwatch are wrong, but I suspect that at the moment that's a bet that few people would take. It'll be interesting to see what the official word on the subject is in the coming weeks.
Thanks to 853Blog for the Southeastern reminder.
Buried deep in Southeastern's website is your answer...
ReplyDelete"It's envisaged we'll be able to introduce Oyster PAYG sometime in 2010."
BBC quoted a City Hall spokesman as saying:
ReplyDelete"Should any companies look like dragging their feet on this then the Mayor and Transport for London (TfL) will swiftly point out to them the tremendous improvement for their passengers this investment will deliver."The ToCs must be trembling in their shoes at such a stern threat.
The ToCs are milking this for as much funding and 'sweeteners' as they can get from TfL / DfT etc. It's interesting that the only areas where it's really accepted yet is where there was competition from Oyster alternatives. The rest of the ToCs (mostly south of the river) have less commercial incentive... DfT need to start enforcing some of those franchise obligations.
@853blogThanks for reminding me about that! I'll update the article.
ReplyDeleteI remember firing off an email to southeastern about that statement ages ago and getting an email that can be paraphrased as "um... we mean January... honest... and nobody can prove otherwise..."
I knew it had been put back to 2010 but no dates. Seems the situation is one or more TOC not agreeing delaying the whole thing. FCC is on the testing phase right now as all stations now have Oyster readers.
ReplyDelete"...significant investment with additional validators needed..."
ReplyDeleteExcept that that clearly isn't the problem - not only have the TOCs had getting towards ten years to arrange this moderate upgrade, but Ken Livingstone even agreed a deal where TFL WOULD PAY for them all.
So what's the real problem? At a guess, it's politics and negotiation. The TOCs know this is a political must-have and there's not much in it for them so they're holding out for the best deal.
The previous mayor's oft-quoted 'deal to pay for TOC Oyster implementation' was unfunded, along with a great many other proposed schemes.
ReplyDeleteOyster implementation London-wide is very expensive indeed. Commentators almost entirely approach the topic from the point of view of the consumer, for whom Oyster is marvellous.
They almost never see the large sum of implementation as taxpayers, for whom the bill will be eye-watering. For their part, TfL, the DfT, and the TOCs are having to make hard decisions about where to spend money on maintaining existing capacity and new projects.
Switching from paper tickets to electronic tickets (TOC fares won't alter for Oyster users) is therefore a very expensive innovation for which nobody seems too keen to pay for.
Unless Oyster fares should be higher to recoup some of the capital investment? Or we should spend less on other areas of public expenditure? Scale back some of the present Tube upgrades? Or accept smaller pensions from reduced TOC dividends? Or we all pay a bit more tax - say a lump sum of £100 per head hypothecated to London-wide Oyster implementation?
Oyster is nice to use. But as with many investment decisions, it comes with significant costs which have to be prioritised across the whole range of public expenditure. It's silly to expect it just to happen so long as 'someone else' pays for it.
Anonymous, whilst you raise some valid points, the vast majority of ToCs have renewed their ticket issuing infrastructure and back-office software, so if Oyster implementation had been done at the same time, the incremental cost would have been lower.
ReplyDeleteOyster also saves money for the ToCs - more people can pass through barriers per minute (no moving parts), quicker to read the ticket, and less people standing in front of the barriers faffing (so less barriers needed at newly-gated stations), people do not buy a ticket per journey on Oyster and so the transactional cost per journey lowers too.
If the TOCs don't like it, they can always hand their franchises back. Nobody's forcing the poor lambs to run railways, but the consumer is forced to use their shoddy services.
ReplyDeleteIf the operators drag their heels over implementing Oyster PAYG, it does of course delay the [url=http://londonreconnections.blogspot.com/2009/04/tfl-board-reports-0309.html]World of Oyster map[/url] and its effect of marginalising BAA’s Heathrow Express rip-off/cash cow. I’m sure that’s just a coincidence…
ReplyDeleteWhy this obsession with a big-bang rollout and a fixed completion date? If the TOCs won't play ball and the DfT won't make it a franchise requirement, you can hardly blame TfL.
ReplyDeleteHow about pushing to fill the gaps with the TOCs that already accept oyster first e.g. NXEA to Enfield, Chingford and Harold Wood and FCC to FCC to Elstree, Hadley Wood and Crews Hill?
Then allow FCC to rollout PAYG on to/from stations it doesn't manage on Wimbledon, Sutton and Brighton routes. Then rollout on a route by route basis starting with say the Greenwich or Windsor line.
I'm sure most people would rather see continuous progress month by month.
Unfortunately, Boris's current Tory literature is claiming credit for getting Oyster onto NR "this year" - hence the anger at him/TfL.
ReplyDeleteClearly he wanted to try a different approach to Ken, but it seems to have gone up in his face.
More boasts from BoJo the Clown which have turned out to be hot air.
ReplyDeleteWhat a buffoon!
Why this obsession with a big-bang rollout and a fixed completion date? Because an enormous amount of route modelling work is required to make sure prices are worked out reasonably for every possible pair of stations, and to work out how to allocate revenue, and so on. I'd assume all model development work thus far has been done on the basis of every TOC signing on.
ReplyDeleteI thought pricing and revenue allocation issues would have been sorted out as part of the switch to zonal fares for National Rail services?
ReplyDeleteIf, as I thought would be the case, that Rail fares will not be any cheaper on PAYG then Oyster only changes the way that revenue is collected. The system would be able to tell whether someone used the tube or train to be able to make the correct charge and apportion it appropriately.
fares will be no cheaper - but what about oyster price capping? currently if i've built up enough over the day for a day travelcard over the zones I'm travelling, I still have to fork out a cash train fare - I thought part of the point of rolling PAYG to national rail would be elimnate this injustice?
ReplyDelete@ 853blog 12:08
ReplyDeleteBut we all know that TOC’s don’t run railways… they manage car parks…
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-business/article-23690687-details/Revealed%3A+FirstGroup%27s+secret+%C2%A350m+bailout+from+taxpayer/article.do
In filling would make sense, ie Chingford branch, north of West Hampstead.
ReplyDeleteHowever south of Elephant & Castle and London Bridge is a no-no. You start mixing different operators services with FCC's meaning customers will be confused. The amount of people who touch in at West Hampstead then head north is amazingly high. Customers don't understand and don't wish to.
The sooner this is sorted the better. The PAYG Oyster fares are going to be the same as cash fares on NR services until you hit the travelcard cap. I fear this is the reason for the hold up as the Oyster cap is lower than cash fares and if everyone suddenly started getting this discount then the TOCs would see reduced income as a time when they want to maxiumize it.
Can someone tell me how Oyster price capping works if you have a paper annual gold card? With paper tickets you can buy an off-peak zone 1-6 travelcard from a National Rail station for £5 rather than £7.50. My annual ticket is between a station inside the zones and one just outside which doesn't look like it's going to install Oyster readers any time soon. With Oyster PAYG, would the pricing revert to what would be paid at a Tube station, i.e. without the gold card discount?
ReplyDeleteNick: Oyster PAYG doesn't currently offer any discount for any Gold Card holders, so you'd be paying the full cap, and the best value option will remain a paper travelcard.
ReplyDeleteIt’s so nice site. We love to see more on this site. Keep on updating… MonkAreRee Bali ***sdrfg
ReplyDeleteBoris's Transport Strategy Statement of Intent says (p. 42) it will be "[a]ccepted within the 2009/10
ReplyDeletefinancial year"
Given the comment on the South Eastern web site that "Oyster PAYG will not be cheaper than our usual rail fares", one wonders what "the price benefits of the Oystercard" that Travelwatch mention are?
ReplyDeleteAnd if Oyster PAYG and 'usual' fares are going to be the same, how are return journey fares going to work under PAYG?